page title icon collaboration

Edward Marshall - What is Collaborative Leadership and How to Apply it in Customer Experience

What is Collaborative Leadership and How to Apply it in Customer Experience?

Collaboration creates ethical and trust-based relationships with the customer, and it is important to learn collaboration skills to help you do that. Have you ever wondered why geese fly in a V-formation? Scientists gives us two explanations, and we can actually learn a lot important collaborative leadership lessons from them! First, it’s about energy conservation. …

Access Now

Phyllis Weiss Haserot - You Can't Google It

194: Phyllis Weiss Haserot: The degree of frustration I felt is enormous

Phyllis Weiss Haserot Show Notes Page

Phyllis Weiss Haserot shares the leadership skills she has had to lean on as her husband’s Parkinson’s disease rapidly progressed while she is passionately pushing forward her work in cross-generational conversation at work.

Phyllis, dubbed “the cross-generational voice,” was born and raised in New York City/Manhattan to parents involved in liberal political movements – a lawyer and social worker, appreciative of diversity – who she believes would be very much in tune with her values and mission today. They taught her to question what is and to figure out things for herself. Always, at times when she felt she had no compelling dreams or passions, she put one foot in front of the other and kept going forward. Optimism, resilience and determination – you can’t Google those!

Her wonderful dad, who she was close to, unfortunately died when she was 16. From him she gained her interest in history, political science and law. He took her frequently to her then beloved Yankee games (though he preferred the other team), and she has been an avid baseball fan since (though switching allegiance to the Mets (given her husband’s sports tickets). She’s always had relatively easy relationships with males since early on – perhaps sports knowledge helped.

Phyllis emerged as a leader by third grade. She has always thrived on a diversity of interests, blessed with infinite curiosity and interest in meeting new people.

Her career trajectory evolved from an early career as an urban planner to marketing consultant to multigenerational workplace expert and champion of cross-generational conversation. In recent years, she realized the common thread in her path could be an interest in demographics and analysis of patterns to devise problem-solving strategies. A trailblazer in marketing/business development for law and other professional service firms, Phyllis leads as a consultant, facilitator, coach, speaker and thought-leading author of several business books. She is President & Founder of Practice Development Counsel and founder of Cross-Generational Conversation Day.

After living briefly in several other states for a few years early in her career, Phyllis, returned to New York, with a view looking out on the other river surrounding Manhattan. Her passions outside of work are musical theater, jazz, improve, baseball, and collecting and wearing wearable art. An active Cornell alum, she is married with one Millennial/Gen x cusper son on his 3rd career and a side hustle, who has followed his passions. She taught him well to be comfortable with strong women and to do his fair share of domestic tasks, like his father.

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to @phylliswhaserot to get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShow – Click to Tweet  

“People are really retreating more into their own tribes and afraid to address important things.” – Click to Tweet 

“We have to work at getting people to be a lot less resistant to talking to people they don’t really know.” – Click to Tweet   

“It’s very important to understand people’s perspectives and expectations.” – Click to Tweet 

“What kind of influences formed the way you think and behave?” – Click to Tweet

“To be curious about people is really a blessing.” – Click to Tweet 

“You can’t be a good relationship builder if you’re not curious about people.” – Click to Tweet 

“We need a lot more succession planning than is being done, in all kinds of industries.” – Click to Tweet

“We have to get beyond theoretical to make change.” – Click to Tweet 

“You can’t learn or acquire a practice by googling.” – Click to Tweet 

“Vulnerability helps create strong relationships.” – Click to Tweet 

“In all parts of our lives, networking is very important.” – Click to Tweet 

Hump to Get Over

Phyllis Weiss Haserot shares the leadership skills she has had to lean on as her husband’s Parkinson’s disease rapidly progressed while she is passionately pushing forward her work in cross-generational conversation at work.

Advice for others

Make certain to focus on networking both personally and professionally.

Holding her back from being an even better leader

Needing to simplify.

Best Leadership Advice

Showing vulnerability, but with grit.

Secret to Success

Belief in people to come through in they’re inspired.

Best tools in business or life

Reading and conversing widely to understand people and connect the dots in patterns of behavior.

Recommended Reading

You Can’t Google It!: The Compelling Case for Cross-Generational Conversation at Work

Problem Solved: A Powerful System for Making Complex Decisions with Confidence and Conviction

Contacting Phyllis Weiss Haserot

website: https://www.youcantgoogleit.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/pwhaserot/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/phylliswhaserot

Resources and Show Mentions

Call Center Coach

Public Speaking

 

Show Transcript: 

Click to access edited transcript

194:  Phyllis Weiss Haserot: The degree of frustration I felt is enormous

 

Intro: Welcome to the Fast Leader podcast, where we explore convenient yet effective shortcuts that will help you get ahead and move forward faster by becoming a better leader. And now here’s your host, customer and employee engagement expert and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, Jim Rembach.

 

Call center coach develops and unites the next generation of call center leaders. Through our e-learning and community individuals gain knowledge and skills in the six core competencies that is the blueprint that develops high-performing call center leaders. Successful supervisors do not just happen so go to callcentercoach.com to learn more about enrollment and download your copy of the Supervisor Success Path e-book now.

 

Jim Rembach:     Okay, Fast Leader legion, today I’m excited because I have somebody on the show today who’s really going to help us connect across the different generations that we currently have both in the workplace and in our professional life. Phyllis Weiss Haserot, dub the cross generational voice, was born and raised in New York City in Manhattan, to parents involved in liberal, political movements. A lawyer and social worker appreciative of diversity who she believes would be very much in tune with her values and mission today. They thought her to question what is and to figure out things for herself. Always at times when she felt she had no compelling dreams or passion she put one foot in front the other and keep going forward, optimism, resilience and determination, you can’t Google those. Her wonderful dad who she was close to unfortunately died when she was 16. From him she gained her interest in history, political science and law. He took her frequently to her then beloved Yankee Yanks, though he preferred the other team, and she has been an avid baseball fans since. She’s always had relatively easy relationship with males since early on perhaps sports knowledge helped. 

Phyllis emerged as a leader by third grade and she’s always thrive on a diversity of interest lest with the infinite curiosity and interest in meeting new people. Her career trajectory evolved from early career as an urban planner to marketing consultant to multi-generational workplace expert and champion of cross generational conversation. In recent years she realize the common threat and her path could be an interest in demographics and analysis of patterns to device problem solving strategies. A trail blazer in marketing and business development for law and other professional service firms. Phyllis lives as a consultant, facilitator, coach, speaker, and thought leader of several business books. She’s the president and founder of Practice Development Council and founder of Cross-generational conversation day. After living briefly in several other states for a few years earlier in her career, Phyllis return to New York with a view looking out on the other river surrounding Manhattan. Her passion outside of work are musical theatre, jazz, improp, baseball, and collecting and wearing wearable art. An active Cornell alum, she’s married with one millennial GenX cusper son on his third career and a side hustle, who has followed his passion. She though him well to be comfortable with strong women and to do his fair share of domestic task like his father. Phyllis Wise Haserot, are you ready to help us get over the hump?

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     I certainly am, do my best. 

Jim Rembach:     I appreciate you being here. Now given my legion a little bit about you but can you share what your current passion is so that we can get to know you even better?

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     I think it is very much in my work which is what I’ll talk about. As far as my current passion now is championing cross-generational conversation and collaboration it work. I got an idea about five or six years ago for the cross-generational conversation day and wanting to get that into organizations all over and workshops and an ongoing thing got a lot of people excited about it. I love working with all the generations. I get thrilled when they jump in and address issues that I toss out that they all ought to be talking about and feel comfortable with it you create a non-threatening environment.

 

Jim Rembach:     Yeah, I think what you’re talking about is just an easier way by which to approach many of the things that we otherwise would just ignore or not talk about or feel uncomfortable with and being proactive with it instead of reacting in a way that we have to because we didn’t address certain things.

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Definitely true. And I think more and more in the last few years as we’ve seen kinds of feelings and things that people were holding back from expressing come to the surface. People are really retreating more into their own tribes and afraid to address important things. So we really have to work at that and getting people to be a lot less resistant and reticent to talk especially people they don’t really know. 

 

Jim Rembach:     And I think you’ve kind of made things easier looking through your book, You Can’t Google it, the Compelling Case for Cross-Generational conversation at Work, you made up word, you and I before we actually started doing the interview talked about words we’ve made up and one that is important for you, in your message and getting this out is called GENgagement, what is GENgagement? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Okay, and spell it with GEN as all caps, it really is creating a harmony among all the generations in their work sharing what their common goals are understanding the perspective of other people who are not like them all kinds of diversity different ages. If you are born a particular time there are certain things you know and there’s certain things you don’t know because you weren’t brought up with it you never lived with it and it’s very important to understand people’s perspective and expectations. So, GENgagement really is getting people out of their own comfort zone sometimes and understanding the real benefit to themselves as well as their organizations, their communities of getting to know each other developing relationships and having these conversations.

 

Jim Rembach:     I think you even gave an explanation in the book that for me really is a little bit more of a compassionate type of explanation instead of just saying, all those young kids or all those old folks is that you talk about generations really being defined by similar formative influences.

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     When they were born in the specific year there’s flexibility I always say roughly I don’t believe in some of this Census Bureau years that are used. But it’s really all about that what kind of influence is formed the way you think and behave. It could be, depending on what part of the world or what kind of family that you come from that influences it. There are differences if you are a leader and a manager then if you are somebody reporting to those people in terms of the way you think and behave very often. So there are a number of factors that have nothing to do with specific date you were born. We’re talking about political economic social and cultural influences. I jokingly would say I’ve been blessed to have the opportunity to be able to manage 19 year old men and 65 year old boys so even within the different generational groups and the different influences you’ll find different levels of maturity you’ll find different levels of experience and exposure and different types of value systems I mean it becomes quite diverse just within their own age group. And what I love and one of those ten traits and skills that I talk about in the book is curiosity. And to be curious about people is really a blessing and it’s something I’m infinitely curious about a lot of things. And I think you can’t be a good networker and you can’t be a good business developer or relationship building builder if you’re not curious about people. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Yeah, and I even had a guest on the show a couple weeks back that said the future belongs to the curious. 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     I like that. 

 

Jim Rembach:     And so another thing—talking about curious and curiosity is you have a particular in the book called, transition fluidity, what is that?

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     It’s really all about succession planning and knowledge transfer and role shifts. We know that we need a lot more succession planning than is being done in all kinds of industries. All the surveys that are done with CEOs and HR people and they’re asked what are their thought concerns it used to be number one now they have talent  management retention as that but they would say succession planning is it? We got to do this and they’re asked are you doing something about it? Thirty percent would say yes. That’s not good and it’s getting urgent because we have more boomers. As I say, even babies are getting older every day so all those things change and we have to address. And so with succession planning with or without it we need knowledge transfer so that’s the other part of that. I’m talking about beyond the, what you can put in your computer to date the actual data. But again all about relationships conversations the things, the experience that you get from talking with other people. 

 

Jim Rembach:     In the book, which I really liked, is because ultimately what you’re talking about here is changing practices and changing behaviors and building new habits so that you’re actually leveraging the best of all of these different generations. And you have specific action steps within the book each individual chapter which kind of makes this a lot more real, which I really enjoy.

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     We have to get beyond theoretical to make change so yeah I tried to be specific.

 

Jim Rembach:     One of the things that we do as call center coach in order to help develop frontline supervisors is we have boot camps. And the boot camps are focused specifically on, hey do this because we need to build new habits in order to have a different outcome to have that better outcome in order to accelerate our path to success. And so when you start talking about people being able to use these action steps, is there a particular pattern or path that they should take in order to fully leverage it?

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     It probably depends what the action is. I haven’t created an overall system for all of these things. We talked about in there ten traits and skills it’s really both or some of them are in a things or habits and some of them are skills that you need to use that I think are even more important to success. Again the things you can learn, acquire and practice for going out on the Internet but you need to develop relationships and have conversations with people. That’s sad and I think for each of them we looked at through generational lenses. In the book each of the chapters, except for the last one the first one a little bit, we look at the context what’s going on, problem solutions, and then those action steps and their examples of all sorts out in the book. The last chapter which I call inspiration for action has among the quotes and things from interviews I did in preparing for the book. Interview of two or three people of different generations and a wider range of industries about cross- generational conversation, the obstacles, what they thought of it, what they get out of it, what is missing without having that in their work life. I put it together at the end with a few case studies on cross generational conversation day workshops that I did with the large corporation as an example to show how did re-start? Who was responsible for getting management and budgets to support it? And what I love to is it’s very much grassroots action. It was employee resource groups AORG’s who really love. The idea the first one was there were new people that came to the company in the last couple of years. Most of them are on the younger side but not necessarily people that into laterally. And then they went to one of the senior people and got that support but there wasn’t enough budget from there so the next year they went to another one and even higher up and got three other your AORG’s also as part of it’s very grassroots action to say, we believe this is really important and you’ve got to support it. The discussions they had were lively, great people just plunged in and so it was very gratifying and I was very happy to include it in there that’s an example. 

 

Jim Rembach:     I think that’s a really interesting point to say how oftentimes it starts with me as far as that grass root thing is concerned—I have to start  believe in it communicate it show it live by that example share where I got it from and slowly over time we can build a movement. 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     I got a question at one of the events, I’m doing a lot of events around a growth, about who starts these cross-generational conversations or any of these meaningful conversations that I’m talking about. It could be coming from the top it could be coming from the grassroots it could be coming from anyone it could be coming from you. And one of the things that I find inspiring about the younger generations in the lot of states is that they are less reticent to speak up and express their views on things or just want to speak out. To some people they find that it’s not offensive they don’t know how to deal this, the people of older generations, but I’m saying and I think that I’ve just sort of confirmed this from speaking with some younger people they’re not demanding everything that they’re talking about and they’re changing over everything the way they would like to see it but they do want to have a voice especially about anything that affects them. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Most definitely. Now when you start talking about all of these different generations and making these connections and having this dialogue and I am sure that you’ve found a lot of inspiration. One of the things that we use for inspiration on the show are quotes. Is there a quote or two that you like that you can share? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Yeah, definitely and in fact that’s giving me a nice soft ball. The first one I would tell you is you can’t Google it, the meaning of that is even more important to succeed than what you can search for on the Internet or their relationships and conversations you have with people of all generations at work. You can’t learn, acquire or practice by Googling these are the essential traits and skills I referred to you before and they cover books such as perspective, trust, empathy, relevance, reciprocity, high-touch,  curiosity, inspiration, I didn’t hit them all but it gives me the idea of things that are very, very important. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Most definitely. Now all those are emotionally intelligence based and that’s definitely—in my wheelhouse and what I enjoy. When you start talking about the book and a lot of the things that you’ve been doing and this this movement that you’re wanting to create around GENgagement day is that I’m sure there’s a lot of humps that you had to get over to get to this point, is there a time where you’ve got over the hump that you can tell us? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     In my case this story is not the why of my business or life purpose but maybe it’s my recent several months circumstance weighing on me that’s crowding out other challenges out of my mind. Naturally in terms of the cross-generational conversation I’ve always been very much at ease with that even from the very beginning of my career when I came out of a school, the masters in planning and I had people who were both younger and older reporting to me. I realized as I go—my career when went on like that wasn’t so easy for everybody which is one of the reasons that I got so engaged with this generational work. But the challenge that I’m facing and have been facing recently and now still, if you want to hear about that is that—well, my greatest most stressful challenge has been keeping my business thriving and promoting this new important book. This several months since October 2017 when my husband’s health suddenly drastically declined its Parkinson’s progressing quickly and unpredictably after ten years of a slow decline and being functional though slower. Besides the many business responsibilities I have I’ve had to be managing multiple health care aides, schedules, emotional waves and taking all of his responsibilities over and tasks that are under totally unpredictable circumstances. Through it all I’ve always made on my book another writing deadlines and the events I’m doing and my other ongoing commitments but I think there’s some very important leadership lessons or lessons that I’ve learned that I think are important to share. 

 

I’ve been talking to young people about this in the circumstances that I’m going through because we’re going to be seeing more and more of this. There are some illnesses that there are no cures to and more and more people are unfortunately getting this. I know I’m resilient I’m determined and a congenital optimist but a degree of frustration itself is enormous. I love my work I’m happy when I’m doing it and I’ve had great support from colleagues and friends but it’s been a perfect storm and hard to accept when I have to pass on opportunities I’ve worked for. The optimist in me hopes for more and even better opportunities in time. Some lessons that I would like to share are that you have to let go of some goals at least for the time being it’s a hard thing to do and you have to simplify and figure out what the highest priorities and what it is you have to be now and what you can put off even if the opportunities don’t come around again. Another one is that people really want to help so that you should accept it. And very important some things regarding taking care of myself which is everybody’s saying all the time and I do non-negotiable and those are exercise, sleep and eating healthy. I’ve always said that and I’ve always done it but I’ve tested it now and I’ve been doing these things every day without fail and the other thing is spending time with friends and going to events. Lastly that it’s good to be determined and to consider myself number one there’s nothing wrong with that. My vulnerability which is one of the things that I’m saying, I say I’ve learned from this and good advice. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Phyllis thank you for sharing that definitely a lot of prayers coming your way.

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Thank you, thank you. 

 

Jim Rembach:     I have a good friend of mine who has gone through something similar with her husband and talking about a journey and—

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     And he’s not old. This is not something, okay, somebody is 90 or more than that and it’s time and it happened very suddenly changing life. But it does happen and there’s nothing we can do about it except to try to have a good attitude. 

 

Jim Rembach:     And the Fast Leader legion wishes you the very best. Now before we move on let’s get a quick word from our sponsor:

 

Need a powerful and entertaining way to ignite your next conference, retreat or team building session? My keynotes don’t include magic but they do have the power to help your attendees take a leap forward by putting emotional intelligence into their employee-engagement, customer-engagement and customer-centric leadership practices. So bring the infotainment creativity the Fast Leader show to your next event and I’ll help your attendees get over the hump now. Go to beyondmorale.com/speaking to learn more. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Alright, here we go Fast Leader Legion it’s time for the Hump day Hoedown. Okay, Phyllis, the Hump day Hoedown is a part of our show where you give us good insights fast. So I’m going to ask you several questions and your job is to give us robust yet rapid responses that are going to help us move onward and upward faster. Phyllis Weiss Haserot, are you ready to hoedown? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Yes I am. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Alright, so what do you think is holding you back from being an even better leader today? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Maybe as I was saying needing to simplify. I’m interested in doing too much of the things I like doing and sometimes I was also delaying adding more members of my teams. I used to be better at time management but simplifying how to do that and accepting that you can’t do as much as you want even if the things you like and you’re good at. 

 

Jim Rembach:     What is the best leadership advice do you have ever received?

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Related to that and as I was mentioning just before showing vulnerability but with grit I say. And the grit part is that been difficult for me. I think this is advice for both males and females that vulnerability really helps create strong relationships and it’s a benefit to other people too because they do want to help and they want to feel that they’re doing good things for other people. So, share your feelings don’t let things fester and solve conflicts as soon as possible. 

 

Jim Rembach:     What is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     Believing people to come through if they’re inspired and making them feel important and recognized. Also somewhat related to that trusting my insight and conveying I care. 

 

Jim Rembach:     What do you feel is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business or life?

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     I don’t have one piece of technology to recommend but I would say reading and conversing widely to understand people and connect the dots about patterns and behavior. This helps me be interested in and interesting to people and it helps me easily connect and develop rapport.

 

Jim Rembach:     What would be one book that you’d recommend to our listeners it could be from any genre of course we’ll put a link to, You can’t Google it, on your show knows page as well.

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     A new book within the last year called, Problem Solved by Cheryl Strauss Einhorn about a method of decision-making she devised called area. We all have to make many decisions every day and it’s very useful way of looking at things and problem-solving somewhat different than what I’ve seen before. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Okay, Fast Leader Legion you can find links to that another bonus information from today’s show by going to fastleader.net/slash Phyllis Weiss Haserot. Okay, Phyllis, this is my last hump day hoedown question: Imagine you were given the opportunity go back to the age of 25 and you have been given the opportunity to take the knowledge and skills that you have now back with you but you can’t take everything back you can only choose one. So what skill or a piece of knowledge would you take back with you and why?

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     I would say that facility and knowledge about good networking and related to that being able to read personal behavioral style. Again, I’m just like you Jim all about people and we all know that in all parts of our lives not only business but definitely business to networking is very, very important. So many people are either have fear doing it feel really uncomfortable or do it the wrong way. Like going out and talking about themselves all the time instead of asking questions about other people which is the way that you can learn about them learn about what their needs are and again develop a good relationship.

 

Jim Rembach:     Phyllis, it was an honor to spend time with you today can you please share with the Fast Leader Legion how they can connect with you sure? 

 

Phyllis Weiss Haserot:     You can find me in on LinkedIn of course and Twitter I have several websites then the book the new one is, www. Youcantgoogle.com. and you can also get there by going to cross-generational conversation.com and my old very, very huge website is www.pdcounsel.com

 

Jim Rembach:     Phyllis Weiss Haserot, thank you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom the Fast Leader Legion honors you and thanks you for helping us get over the hump. Woot! Woot!

 

Thank you for joining me on the Fast leader show today. For recaps links from every show special offers and access to download and subscribe, if you haven’t already, head on over the www.fastleader.net so we can help you move onward and upward faster. 

 

END OF AUDIO 

 

 

 

095: Steve Goldstein: You don’t get 30 mulligans

Steve Goldstein Show Notes

Steve Goldstein was thrilled to escape the cold of Chicago in February for a speaking engagement in Miami. As an executive at Sears, Steve loved to visit the stores on trips. But this time Steve thought he was hallucinating when he saw snow blowers in Miami. Listen to how this experience led to Steve moving onward and upward.

Steve was a middle child born in the Bronx borough in New York City and had an older sister and younger brother. His mother was a teacher and father was bridge operator.

Always big think and explorer as a child he knew, even with growing up in the city of New York, he know there was more to life and he was willing to get it. Like as a youth when he worked two jobs just so he could buy a car.

Steve eventually graduated from City College in New York and NYU/Stern for business school. He’s had the good fortune to have worked for 3 Fortune 500 companies (American Express, Citigroup and Sears) in various senior level positions including Chairman & CEO of American Express Bank. Steve has also worked in the venture capital arena, investing and helping lead startup companies to transform ideas into viable businesses.

Being a non-conformist at heart, he’s always been challenging the status quo – both in his professional and personal life – and deriving lots of satisfaction in breaking the china and seeing what happens next. Steve is a pioneer at heart.

Currently, he is working with several private equity firms as a senior advisor; speaking to large groups and smaller corporate groups about engagement and leadership and out promoting his new book, Why Are There Snowblowers in Miami? Transform Your Business Using The 5 Principles Of Engagement.

Steve currently lives in NYC with his wife and has two grown children, both of whom also live in NYC.

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to @sdgoldstein and get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShow Click to Tweet

“Engagement is not a word that has gone into the lexicon of business.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet

“If you’re not engaged it’s really hard to be an effective leader.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“At the end of the day, leadership is what makes a company work.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“More so than its products, a company’s leaders are more responsible for the results.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Most leaders are not as good as they need to be.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“It’s executing on the basics that makes the difference between success and failure.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Be aware, observe, and then act.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“A lot of what is happening in your company is hiding in plain sight.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Leaders sit in meetings all day and don’t have a clue on what goes on at the point of sale.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Get out of your office and connect with your customers.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“The more people know, the more successful and effective they can be.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Be open and trust your employees.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Larger companies move at glacial pace.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“With leadership you keep finessing and get a little better every day.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“Treat everyone the same whether it’s the cleaning lady or the president.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“If you don’t know why, you have no reason to assume it’s going to be the same next month.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“My best tool is to listen very hard.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet 

“You really need to have an effective team to get great results.” -Steve Goldstein Click to Tweet   

Hump to Get Over

Steve Goldstein was thrilled to escape the cold of Chicago in February for a speaking engagement in Miami. As an executive at Sears, Steve loved to visit the stores on trips. But this time Steve thought he was hallucinating when he saw snow blowers in Miami. Listen to how this experience led to Steve moving onward and upward.

Advice for others

Ask questions; dig.

Holding him back from being an even better leader

I work at my leadership finesse. There is no end state; you just keep getting a little better every day.

Best Leadership Advice Received

Treat everyone the same whether it’s the cleaning lady or the president of the company.

Secret to Success

I’m very inquisitive. The question I ask most is, “why.”

Best tools that helps in business or Life

To listen very hard and ask a lot of questions.

Recommended Reading

The Wright Brothers

Why Are There Snowblowers in Miami?: Transform Your Business Using the Five Principles of Engagement

Contacting Steve

website: http://stevendgoldstein.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sdgoldstein

Twitter: https://twitter.com/sdgoldstein

Resources

54 Emotional Intelligence (EQ) Competencies List: Emotional Intelligence has proven to be the right kind of intelligence to have if you want to move onward and upward faster. Get your free list today.

 

Show Transcript: 

Click to access edited transcript

095: Steve Goldstein: You don’t get 30 mulligans

 

Intro: Welcome to the Fast Leader Podcast, where we uncover the leadership like hat that help you to experience, break out performance faster and rocket to success. And now here’s your host, customer and employee engagement expert and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, Jim Rembach.

Need a powerful and entertaining way to ignite your next conference, retreat or team-building session? My keynote don’t include magic but they do have the power to help your attendees take a leap forward by putting emotional intelligence into their employee engagement, customer engagement and customer centric leadership practices. So bring the infotainment creativity the Fast Leader show to your next event and I’ll help your attendees get over the hump now. Go to beyondmorale.com/speaking to learn more.

 

Jim Rembach:     Okay, Fast Leader Legion today I’m excited because when I read the title of this person’s book I knew I had have him on the show. Steve Goldstein, was a middle child born in the Bronx Borough in New York City and had an older sister and younger brother. His mom was a teacher and his father was a bridge operator. Always a big thinker and explorer as a child, he knew, even with growing up in the city of New York that there was more to life and he was willing to go get it. Like as a youth, when he worked two jobs just that he can buy a used car. Steve eventually graduated from the City College in New York and NYU Stern for business school. He’s had the good fortune to have worked for three Fortune 500 companies, American Express, Citigroup and Sears, in various senior-level positions including chairman and CEO of American Express Bank.

 

Steve has also worked in a venture-capital arena investing and helping lead startup companies to transform ideas into viable businesses. Being a non-conformist at heart he’s always been challenging the status quo both and his professional and personal life and deriving a lot of satisfaction and breaking the China and seeing what happens next. Steve is a pioneer at hear. Currently, he’s working with several private equity firms as a senior adviser, speaking to large groups and small corporate groups about engagement and leadership and out promoting his new book, “Why are There Snow Blowers in Miami? Transform your business Using Five Principles of Engagement.” Steve currently lives in New York City with his wife and has two grown kids both who also live in New York City. Steve Goldstein, are you ready to help us get over the hump?

 

Steve Goldstein:  I am. Good morning, Jim. Nice to be with you. 

 

Jim Rembach:     I’m glad you’re here. Now I’ve given our listeners a little bit about you but can you tell us what your current passion is so that we get to know you even better?

 

Steve Goldstein:  My current passion is really around engagement. And it’s interesting when you go on Google to look at engagement the first hundred listings or so about weddings and party planners and how to buy a wedding dress and things like that, it’s really not a word that has really gone into the Lexicon of business. But to me engagement is really where it starts because if you’re not engaged it’s very hard to be an effective leader. And I’ve really been fascinated over the last 20 years about leadership because at the end of the day that’s what makes the company work, more so than its products it’s the leaders in the company who actually are responsible for the results. And I found that most leaders are not as good as they need to be and that’s part of what I’ve been working on for the last 20 years.  Eventually I decided I wanted to share my experiences and write a book about that so I could help other leaders improve. 

 

Jim Rembach:    When you say engagement, for me, it’s kind of funny when you’re talking from your perspective saying how it’s not part of the Lexicon of business and all of that. Gosh! I’ve been so immersed in customer care and engagement of customers and employees for 20 years so for me it’s kind of like—what do you mean it’s not part of the Lexicon? But when you talk about the book and the five principles, to me I think I’m reading it and I’m saying, “Well, of course this is common sense” but you’re saying, “no way it’s not common. Can you share the five principles?

 

Steve Goldstein:  Yes. You know, it’s funny, when I finish writing the book and I read probably for the 30th time my first reaction was, this is so obvious who’s going to buy this book? And I realize that because it’s so obvious, is why the book needs to be written. Everybody’s looking for the shiny new object or the latest buzzwords or things of that nature, but the reality is that sometimes doing the basics, not sometimes most times, it’s executing on the basics that really makes the difference between success and failure. So, I codify these five principles basically to give people lanes in which to operate. These are not rules that you have to memorize, these are really sort of flashcards in a way that people can utilize to sort of be aware and observe and then act. 

 

So the first one is called, fresh eyes. And it’s exactly what it means, it means looking at things as if you are a new person coming into a situation. A consultant by definition has fresh eyes, he’s coming in to a company, he’s tail a lot a money and he looks at things and he asks lots of crazy question. A new CEO comes in to a company does the same thing. But if you’ve been the president of the company for five years a lot of what is happening in your company is actually hiding in plain sight and you don’t see it. And it’s in those areas that there’s gold but you have to look for it. 

 

The second one is, connecting. What I mean by connecting is, it’s really engaging at the most intimate level with your employees and your customers. If you think about a story like the Gap, the number of levels between the CEO of a Gap and a part-time sales clerk in San Francisco selling you a T-shirt is in excess of 20. The issue is that the part-time person who’s making $9 an hour is the only person who’s interacting with the customer and the leaders sit meetings all day reviewing numbers and presentations and they really don’t have a clue as to what’s actually going on at the point-of-sale. And the and the and the amazing thing is that these people who are interacting with customers they know exactly what’s going, they know what’s working, they know what’s not working. The things that are not working they know how to fix,  they know what the customers want because they’re hearing from them in real-time what they need and want, but no one’s asking them. So, the whole part of connecting is getting out of your office—I was giving a speech the other day and someone says, “what do you mean get out of your office?” I said, “Nothing good happens in your office, nothing.” I use to spend as little there as possible. So that’s the second principle. 

 

The third principle is transparency. Actually on the on the door of my high school carved in stone was a saying. “Knowledge is power.” And I didn’t know what it meant when I was going to high school, but I do now. I’m a firm believer that the more people know the more successful and effective they can be. We suffer from two problems. We either suffer from not giving people enough information because we don’t trust them or it’s a power thing where you have to ask me for stuff that makes me more powerful because you don’t know the information and it stand in a very sort of subconscious weight. So, one problem is you don’t have enough information to do your job properly. The flipside of that situation is your bury the information. You don’t know what report to look at, you know what’s important, okay. So, the whole thing about transparency is really being open and trusting your employees and communicating with them in a way where they can actually do a great job.

 

The fourth one is speed. Mario Andretti the famous race car driver has a great quotes, he says, if your car’s under control you’re not going fast enough. And the problem, and this is particularly true with larger companies, larger companies move at glacial pace. They express things in terms of months, quarters and years. I was in a meeting in June with C-Suite of this very large company and in this meeting we came up collectively with a great idea, and it was really a tremendous idea, and the CEO said, “Oh, let’s put that into our planning process for 2017, we’ll bake it in to next year’s plan.” And they’re all saying great. And I said, “Wait a minute, if this is really a great idea why don’t we have someone start it next week because you have to believe that there were three other meetings like this going on around the world or that they all think I’ve come up with the next brilliant idea which is the same one as we just came up with, right? And one of those companies is going to start it next week and they may have it in a marketplace by the end of this year. So if you put it in a plan for next year by the time this actually hits the market it could be the summer of 2017 and this other company could’ve walked away with all the winds.” And they said, “Oh, do you really think that’s going to happen?” I said, “Of course it’s going to happen.” 

 

The fifth principle I call hot buttons. And it’s fascinating to go through this process. None of the ideas are stupid. None of the initiatives are dumb but they’re nice to do, they’re nice to have but are not jugular. I’m talking about things, like we don’t do this we’re dead. If we don’t do this we’re going to lose market share. If we don’t do this we can’t grow at 15% compounded for the next three years. So, going through the process of really figuring out what’s absolutely essential from what is nice to do is really the important thing. So that’s a brief summary of the five principles. 

 

Jim Rembach:     Okay, so one thing that really stood out to me, and like you said a lot of them speak for themselves, you use hot buttons a little bit differently than what most people do in regards to thinking about hot buttons, hot buttons there are referring to—hey, that really upset me, that really tick me off. But you’re talking about hot buttons in a different way.

 

Steve Goldstein:  Right.

 

Jim Rembach:     So your hot buttons are really things that are going to ignite people to do something different.

 

Steve Goldstein:  Yes, exactly. And they’re expressed in a way that doesn’t use jargon. It’s done in way where someone in the third grade would understand what the item is so that everyone in the company is very clear on what these three items are. Oftentimes, what happens is the leader will say something in a manner that makes sense to him but if it doesn’t resonate throughout the organization people may have slightly different interpretations about what that means so part of the hot button component is to be very precise with the words. So that whether you’re in 30 states or 30 countries, everyone in the organization knows exactly what those mean and why they’re important.

 

Jim Rembach:     Also it seems to me like you have to really look towards the operating or the functional position because you give an example on the book where you talked about a used car company and their financing expenses and saying how a used car sitting on a lot cost two bucks a day just an interest.

 

Steve Goldstein:  Yes. 

 

Jim Rembach:     And just by communicating the fact that that two bucks a day was something that was occurring cause people to act and behave quite differently than they did previously.

 

Steve Goldstein:  Exactly. And what was interesting is if you think about that example the people who this was directed to we’re the people who responded to this, I should say, were mechanics, they were auto mechanics. These are people who basically, probably don’t have more than a high school education, they surely don’t have college degrees, I’m not saying that in a derogatory sense what I’m saying is these guys are master mechanics, they know how to fix cars better than anybody else. But now when they understood there was a financial consequence for every day the car was sitting there and not out on the lot to be sold they themselves figured out how to change their work processes to move the cars faster through the shop. 

 

They came up with this because they understood it was a consequence to not getting the cars out a day or two or 30 days sooner. And that was the beauty of this hot button, that people at all levels in the company could take away from it what was essential for them to do their own jobs better and then working in teams, they brainstormed and came up with 20 ideas about how individually and collectively they could change the way they behaved in order to recognize this two dollars a day. It frankly was amazing to me to see how they responded way beyond what I ever might’ve expected and that’s the beauty of that.

 

Jim Rembach:     And so for me, I think it’s kind of like using fresh eyes in order to find out what’s the right hot button, I think we have to do that. Obviously, you’re a tenured—a person who has accumulated a wealth of wisdom and I’m sure it’s being leveraged by the venture capitalist that you’re working with but we need inspiration, this book is inspirational and the five principles, I would love to even get in the conversation about difference between principles and rules, but we’ve got to move on. And so, when you start talking about quotes, we love quotes on the show and I’m sure you have a lot that you’ve accumulated over the years, but is there one or two that you can share with us the gives you inspiration?

 

Steve Goldstein:  There’s one quote that I came across, I think it was the late 70’s in a BusinessWeek article, and it was said by a guy named Edward Cole who was an executive at General Motors, he had been a lifelong employee of General Motors and I think at this point he was running the engine in one of the divisions, and this is what he said, “Leadership is the courage to admit mistakes, the vision to welcome change, the enthusiasm to motivate others, and the confidence to stay out of step when everyone is marching to the wrong tune.” And that to me sort of epitomized what a great leader should. Actually I try to follow this, I mean I really do my best to follow this and it’s not always the most popular way to behave but I think this quote really sums up what I believe a leader should be.

 

Steve Goldstein:  Well I think even reading your bio when you started talking about breaking the China and seen what happens, I can see why that quote means a lot to you. And obviously in order for you to get to the point of being that young kid in the Bronx, who is that constant explorer and wanting more knowing there was more, being the CEO of some large division for some very large organizations, there’s had to be a lot of humps along the way that you had to get over that cause you to get the place where you are now and being able to write this book and help others move forward. Is there a story that you can share with us when you had to get over the hump? 

 

Well, the most, I think, profound story is really the story that became the title of the book. When I was at Sears running the credit card business, I’ll give you the short version of this the longer version’s in the book, I was based in Chicago obviously were Sears is headquartered and it was February a blustery cold winter like the polar vortex we just had. I had to go to Miami to give a speech, in February, so I was very excited to the warm weather and I always made a point to visit the stores to see what we could do to help improve sales. So, I went in to the store, I happen to go into the Lawn and Garden center entrance and I saw lawn mowers, rakes, shovels, patio furniture, barbecue grills, then I saw a show blowers and I thought I was hallucinating. And I went over to see them and there was an elderly salesman named Pete and it just came out to mouth I said, “Pete, why are there snow blowers in Miami?” Basically the short version of the story is every September the snow blowers were delivered, they were told to put on the floor every April they pack them back in Carnes and send them back to the distribution center. And when I said to him, “What do you do about it?” He says, “Well, my boss calls, his boss calls, the store manager calls, and they basically tell it’s part of the national allocation. I said, “You know what that means?” He said, “I have no idea what that means.” I said, “Have you ever sold any?” He said, “We sold one to a couple who is visiting their kids in Minnesota for Christmas, they put it in minivan, they drove up from Miami to Minnesota, and that was it.”

 

So the next day I go back to—again my speech was like this thing was bothering me the whole afternoon, we are at our weekly leadership meeting and not surprising we’re out of snow blowers because of the snowstorm and I pull at my pocket this guy’s business card and I say we’ll there are four in Miami, call Pete, you have them and they’re hysterically laughing. And I said, “Why is this funny?”  And now it’s hysterical, and I said, “No, it’s terrible.” And so, I then had my—this is free Internet, I had my assistant find out in the history of recorded weather, how much does it snowed in Miami. And then she came back 45 minutes later and said it’s snowed one time seven years ago a third of an inch. So you said to yourself, how the heck could this be part of a national allocation? And you know, to me it was a metaphor and I started to think at that moment, of all the other sort of experiences I had that were equally insane, and you know in golf you got a mulligan if you hit a bad shot, you don’t get a 30 mulligans. And so, this was not just a problem that someone sent snow blowers to Miami the problem was that no one was looking, no one cared, no one saw this things going back and forth for 30 years. No one was asking questions, no one was interested to talk to the store manager, it was a complete and utter breakdown in business processes. And by the way, it’s not unique to Sears every company has snow blowers. In fact, when I went to write a book I interviewed 15 CEO’s and I told them all the story because I wanted them to understand what I wanted from them in return and out of the 15 people I interviewed I had the same reaction a hundred percent of the time. First they laugh, then they said that’s crazy and then they said, oh, I’ve got 20 snow blower stories which one do you want to hear, became a noun because people have all seen this craziness.

 

Jim Rembach:     How could you not laugh? So I have to know—you went back and you had that meeting and what eventually happened with the whole snow blower thing in Miami? 

 

Steve Goldstein:  I don’t know what had happened but this December, just literally less than a year ago, I finished the book and I was going to go down to Miami to see if they’re still there. I said let me call. And I call the store and I said, “Can I—so it turns out they’re no longer there. So they weren’t there this December. I don’t know when in the prior 20 years they stop being shipped there but finally the practice was corrected. I thought I would have been hysterical if they were still there I could take a picture and put it the book, but fortunately they were no longer there. 

 

Jim Rembach:     If we all only had 20 years in order to fix problems I guess maybe they’ll all get fixed sometime, I don’t know or is it kind of run into an infinity, I have no idea. Okay, so, you had mentioned some of that working—as an advisor, working with a venture capital firms, working with a lot of different organizations in order to help them with these five principles and all of that. And you also talked about several other things you’re working on but what are some of your goals?

 

Steve Goldstein:  My goals now are really to—I have a few goals, one is to work with private equity firms to help them run their portfolio companies more effectively and that really comes from leadership. So, I’m spending a lot of time with them working with their individual companies as well as helping them evaluate new acquisitions. I’m spending a fair amount of time writing in part to promote the book but in part to just get my ideas down on paper or on blogs and promulgate some of those thoughts. I’m spending time promoting the book, now that I have the book out there I want to let people know about the book so that they can buy it and learn from it and apply some of the things that are in the book. And I spend a lot of time trying to keep fit, which I think is really important so you can enjoy your life. My wife and I like to travel so we’ve incorporated that we took a great trip almost a year ago to Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos, it’s part of the world that I always wanted to see and so that was that was a lot of fun. And I’m recently, I haven’t had the time, but I’m trying to carve out the time to re-engage back to engagement playing the saxophone. I played the saxophone when I was a kid I just decided I want to for a long, long hiatus I want to get back in and start playing again. So, that’s keeping me pretty busy. 

 

Jim Rembach:    And the  Fast Leader Legion wishes you the very best. Now before we move on let’s get a quick word from our sponsor:

 

The number one thing that contributes to customer loyalty is emotions. So move onward and upward faster by getting significantly deeper insight and understanding of your customer journey and personas with emotional intelligence. With your empathy mapping workshop you’ll learn how to evoke and influence the right customer emotions that generate improve customer loyalty and reduce your cost to operate. Get over your emotional hump now by going to empathymapping.com to learn more.  Alright here we go Fast Leader Legion, it’s time for the Hump Day Hoedown. Okay, Steve the Hump Day Hoedown is the part of our show where you give us good insights fast. So, I’m going to ask you several questions and your job is to give us a robust yet rapid responses that are going to help us move onward and upward faster. Steve Goldstein, are you ready to hoedown?

 

Steve Goldstein:  Yes.

 

Jim Rembach:     Alright. So what do you think is holding you back from being even better leader today? 

 

Steve Goldstein:  I think I’m pretty good as a leader right now and I think what I’ve learned is it’s more about finesse which I think comes with practice. And I’m very conscious about this I work at this every day. I’m very I’m very careful about what I say, I’m very careful about how I listen and it’s all designed with the notion of how do I get the person I’m interacting with other people I’m interacting with to really understand what we need to do and to enable them to be more successful. I don’t think there’s end state here I think it’s just something—unlike being a great artist or anything else where it’s not something that’s measurable I think it’s just something that you keep finessing and doing and you just get a little better every day.

Jim Rembach:    What is the best leadership advice you have ever received?

 

Steve Goldstein:    The best leadership advice I’ve ever received which is actually from my first boss when I got out of graduate school is to treat everyone the same, whether it’s the cleaning lady or the president of the company.  I was in a meeting with him, I was only like 25 years old and we were doing an all-nighter because we had a big pitch we were making and I went in to his office at 11 o’clock to show him my work and to see how I was going to mark it up with a red pen. And so we’re in this heated discussion and the cleaning lady walks in to clean his office. And he starts talking to her like his best friend—how’s your kids, son had broken his leg and everything—and she leaves and I said, “You know the cleaning lady?” and he goes, “Yeah, she’s got a family, she’s got a life.” And I realized, and he was curious like…cause I didn’t know how you suppose to—I just had this—I don’t know I was stupid I thought because you’re an executive you don’t talk to certain people, that’s we saw on movies or on TV. And so I saw from him in a very human way that you really do treat people the same and so I’ve been doing this from that moment on, I became friends with the window washer when I lived in London in our building who all of my leadership team saw this crazy American is going out to the pub with the window washer, what’s wrong with him? And I told them, I learn more from this guy than I learned from them, about our company. Because he was in the building every day he knew everything that was going on. 

 

Jim Rembach:    What is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success?

 

Steve Goldstein:   I’m very inquisitive. I’ve always been this way and I think the question I asked most is why. I think a lot of people and I was talking to somebody about this the other day in a board meeting,  you know, everybody focuses on what and how and where and when and it’s all static but the real motivation for understanding why things happened no one asks. You know that if you made $20 this year and last quarter you made $10 you doubled your results. Great. But most people don’t know why and if you don’t know why, you have no reason to assume it’s going to be the same next month because you don’t know what caused it in the first place. I know this sounds silly I’m amazed that people really don’t dig. A lot of retailers when I have bad results they blame the weather. It’s amazing to me that a food like Walmart will say, we had great results. Macy’s will say, we didn’t have great results and it is attributable to the weather. Are they operating at a different weather system than Walmart? So, you have to laugh when you hear that because what it really means is they don’t know they’re just grasping at straws to come up with something that seemingly explains what is inexplicable because they really don’t know what the underlying reason for the outcome is.

 

Jim Rembach:    What is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business or life? 

 

Steve Goldstein: I think my best tool is to listen very hard and ask a lot of questions.

 

Jim Rembach:     What would be one book, and it could be from any genre, that you’d recommend to our listeners?

 

Steve Goldstein:  The book I would recommend is, why there’s snow blowers in Miami? Actually I would recommend a good book that I read recently which I thought was terrific, is David McCullough’s book about the Wright brothers. When you realize what these two guys did to learn how to fly to prove that man could fly it was one of the most inspiring books about persistence, sticktoitiveness, ingenuity, solving problems, working as a team, marching to their own beat when everybody was telling them they were marching to the wrong tune, it was just a fantastic book.

 

Jim Rembach:     Okay, Fast Leader listeners you can find links to that and other bonus information from today show by going to fastleader.net/Steve Goldstein. Okay, Steve this is my last Hump Day Hoedown question: Imagine you were given the opportunity to go back to the age of 25. And you’ve been given the opportunity to take the knowledge and skills that you have now back with you but you can’t take everything you only choose one. So, what skill or piece of knowledge would you take back with you and why?

 

Steve Goldstein:  I think the thing I would do differently is to learn how to collaborate better and work more effectively in teams. When I was younger it was more about proving myself and sort of creating my own space and seeing what I could do to move up in the business world. And I think I always was a good team player but I probably was a little bit more interested in moving myself forward that moving the team forward with being conscious about it, subconsciously I’m sure I was but not consciously and today I’m extremely conscious of that. I know that you really need to have an effective team to get great results just like in sports.

 

Jim Rembach:     Steve, it was an honor to spend time with you today, can you please share with the Fast Leader Legion how they can connect with you?

 

Steve Goldstein:  Yeah. The best way to connect with me is on my website, stevendgoldstein.com or on Twitter @stgoldstein or you can shoot me an e-mail at steve@stgoldstein.com.

 

Jim Rembach:     Steven Goldstein, thank you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom the Fast Leader Legion honors you and thank you for helping us get over the hump. Woot! Woot!

 

Thank you for joining me on the Fast Leader show today. For recaps, links from every show, special offers and access to download and subscribe, if you haven’t already, head on over the fastleader.net so we can help you move onward and upward faster. 

 

END OF AUDIO 

 

 

084: Brian Sullivan: They all had their political agendas

Brian Sullivan Show Notes

Brian Sullivan worked for an organization that would bring together an executive committee to make decisions on business they wanted to pursue. Because of all of their political agendas, the system wasn’t serving the company or customers very well. That’s when Brian pioneered a more customer-centric approach to sales that helped them to win better deals and avoid pursuing the bad deals.

Brian was born in Baltimore, Maryland with two older brothers and an older sister. He grew up playing lacrosse, tending bars, waiting tables and eventually he received his undergraduate degree and his MBA in Marketing from Loyola University Maryland.

He began his professional career with Xerox Corp., where he learned a great deal about needs-based selling and client focus in an energized, team selling environment. After moving on from Xerox, he began his 30-year career with Cap Gemini in a sales role but soon moved on to leadership and management positions serving clients and growing business with this Paris-based global consulting firm.

While at Cap Gemini, Brian became familiar with the Sandler Selling System and joined Sandler in 2012 to develop Sandler Enterprise Selling, the subject of the book he co-authored with CEO, Dave Mattson, Sandler Enterprise Selling – Winning, Growing and Retaining Major Accounts. Brian is currently the Vice-President of Sandler Enterprise Selling and responsible for the program’s operation worldwide.

Brian is a lifelong runner that lives in Phoenix, Maryland with his wife Cyndi. They are the parents of three daughters and the grandparents of Quinn and Max.

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to Brian Sullivan and get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShow Click to Tweet 

“Selling is really about having a clear understanding of the needs of the people you deal with.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet

“Clearly understand the needs of people you’re with so you know how to help them.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Understand the needs of the people on your team so you can marshal them effectively.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“A decision to move forward or to stop moving forward; both are gifts.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Make early exists or early acceleration.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“You don’t have unlimited resources to help you win a deal.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Understanding the level of risk you’re facing will give you the gift of exiting the process.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“It’s really about having a solid process to help you make decisions.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Go after business based on what’s best for the client.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Don’t confuse sales and delivery.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Bring the delivery folks into the decision early on.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Do what you’ll say you’ll do.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Have a mindset of responsiveness for the people that you serve.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“We all better be making mistakes.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“You win or you learn.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

“Be flexible and willing to stray from the plan.” -Brian Sullivan Click to Tweet 

Hump to Get Over

Brian Sullivan worked for an organization that would bring together an executive committee to make decisions on business they wanted to pursue. Because of all of their political agendas, the system wasn’t serving the company or customers very well. That’s when Brian pioneered a more customer-centric approach to sales that helped them to win better deals and avoid pursuing the bad deals.

Advice for others

Make early exists or early acceleration using a system to help guide you.

Holding him back from being an even better leader

The challenge of keeping pace with technology and social media.

Best Leadership Advice Received

Do what you’ll say you’ll do.

Secret to Success

It’s having a service mentality and a mindset of responsiveness for the people that I serve.

Best tools that helps in business or Life

I have two of them; there’re my ears.

Recommended Reading

Sandler Enterprise Selling:  Winning, Growing, and Retaining Major Accounts

Black Box Thinking: Why Most People Never Learn from Their Mistakes–But Some Do

Contacting Brian

email: brian.sullivan [at] sandler.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brian-sullivan-8a33593

Resources

54 Emotional Intelligence (EQ) Competencies List: Emotional Intelligence has proven to be the right kind of intelligence to have if you want to move onward and upward faster. Get your free list today.

Show Transcript: 

Click to access edited transcript

084: Brian Sullivan: They all had their political agendas

 Intro: Welcome to the Fast Leader Podcast, where we explore convenient yet effective shortcuts that will help you get ahead and move forward faster by becoming a better leader. And now here’s your host, customer and employee engagement expert and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, Jim Rembach.

Need a powerful and entertaining way to ignite your next conference, retreat or team-building session? My keynotes don’t include magic but they do have the power to help your attendees take a leap forward by putting emotional intelligence into their employee- engagement, customer-engagement and customer-centric leadership practices. So bring the infotainment creativity the Fast Leader show to your next event and I’ll help your attendees get over the hump now. Go to beyondmorale.com/speaking to learn more. 

 

Okay Fast Leader legion today we’re going to have a great show because our guest has insights to some of the skills that all of us needs today. Brian Sullivan was born in Baltimore, Maryland with two older brothers and an older sister. He grew up playing across tending bars, waiting tables and eventually he received his undergraduate degree and his MBA in marketing from Loyola University Maryland. He began his professional career with Xerox Corporation where he learned a great deal about needs-based selling and client focus and an energized team selling environment. After moving from Xerox, he began his 30 year career with Cap Gemini in a sales role but soon moved on to leadership and management position serving clients and growing businesses with this Paris-based global consulting firm. While at Cap Gemini, Brian became familiar with the Sandler selling system and join Sandler in 2012 to develop the Sandler Enterprise selling, the subject of the book he co-authored with CEO Dave Mattson, Sandler Enterprise Selling – Winning, Growing and Retaining Major Accounts.

Brian is currently the Vice-President of Sandler Enterprise Selling is responsible for the program’s operation worldwide. Brian is a lifelong runner that lives in Phoenix, Maryland with his wife Cindy and they are the proud parents of three daughters and the grandparents of Quinn and Max. Brian Sullivan are you ready to help us get over the hump?

 

Brian Sullivan:    Ready to go Jim. Well done couldn’t have said that better myself.

Jim Rembach:    Thanks I appreciate that.  I’ve given listeners a little bit about you but can you tell us what your current passion is so that we can get to know you even better?

Brian Sullivan:    Yeah.  My passion is really involved with what I do from the Sandler Enterprise, Selling Standpoint, we rolled out this program eighteen months ago and my role is to support the Sandler network of franchisees all over the world and helping them deliver this program and delight their clients. 

Jim Rembach:    You and I had the opportunity to chat a little bit before and even though you’re talking about the work and what you’re doing it seemed to me like one of your major passion comes down to helping others. You talked about where your career was launched and you’d mentioned something about waiting tables and tending bar and doing all that and how that was just a major passion and really got you into enjoying what you’re doing today, how did you find your way so quickly?

Brian Sullivan:    It’s a great question Jim. I believe strongly in the service mentality about what you do from a life standpoint and also from the selling standpoint. And if you think about it, selling is really about having a clear understanding of the needs of the people that you deal with so that you can earn the right to either help them or understand clearly that you can help them, that’s really what selling is all about. And if you think about it, it’s not a bad way to live your life clearly understanding the needs of people you’re with, so that you know how to help them one way or the other. That’s what I strongly believe in, the service mentality of selling. And as you know so many people have view of selling as being the giving, the pushing, the pitching, that’s really, really not what’s it’s all about. 

Jim Rembach:    One of the reasons I want to have you on the show is—first of all, myself I’ve been exposed to the Sandler Selling system for many years but looking at the six strategies and the 13 tools that are associated with enterprise process it started me down a path of thinking about how really today when you start looking at any initiative of significance is that people have to do a job two ways. First of all if I’m selling a solution for those initiatives, yes, the outside piece and doing all that’s important but also internally the selling has become more challenging with more stakeholders involved and it isn’t something that you could easily just go into have your business case and pitch for it, it requires much more than that.

Brian Sullivan:    Yeah. You mentioned the internal piece—we tend to view enterprise selling as really working internally and externally. From an external standpoint clearly you’re selling into large complex organizations that bring unique challenges such extended sales cycles and really sophisticated competitors and wide, diversified networks but with that comes the challenge and the opportunity if you will of marshaling all of the resources in your organization to address those very challenges. Truthfully that can call on all your sales skills, all of your of abilities, as I’ve mentioned before, to understand the needs of the people on your team so that you can marshal them effectively to serve your clients. 

Jim Rembach:    Men that’s a really keyword that you’ve just laid out a couple of times and that’s that marshaling piece. And if you started looking at folks, put about inside and outside selling, when you start thinking about that marshaling process, what does that mean?

Brian Sullivan:    If you think about it, if you’re ultimate objective in an organization—when business serve clients then you need to make certain that your aligning all of the assets within your organization, people typically figuring the physical assets but the human assets as well, aligning all of those assets can to map to the clients whose business you’re trying to win. I mentioned before that typically in selling into enterprise organizations you’re dealing with the wide diversified network as opposed to simple selling if you will where quite often you can be sitting across the desk from the owner of the company in selling into large complex organizations you’re dealing with a network of buyers that bring functions from legal, from accounting, from finance, it’s your responsibility and again to use that word to marshal the assets of your organization to align to those people in the buyer network, to map if you will docs with docs. If you think about it Jim—have you ever seen a situation where a sales rep is trying to deal with an attorney from a buying organization, they absolutely don’t speak the same language. But if you map it so that an attorney from your organization is dealing with someone from the buying team the conversation becomes so much more streamlined it’s no longer about clauses and semicolons quite often it’s about where you went to school or who you knew in law school. 

Jim Rembach:    That’s a great point, it goes back to that personal connection piece. Now I do know from myself throughout my professional career even when it came to the face-to-face retail sale to some of the complex selling that I have to do now, is that it requires a level of resilience and boldness. You have to be able to keep moving forward to do some of that marshaling and all of that and patience, oh my goodness, of all of those things come into play. And one of the things we look to on the show is quotes because a lot of times they help give us those reminders of those things to help us keep moving forward, is are quote or two that you can share with us?

Brian Sullivan:    Yeah.  That’s a great point. The concept in this enterprise world of moving forward as you say a decision to move forward or decision to stop moving forward both of those are guess. So what I like to talk about is you need to be able to make early exits or early acceleration. When you’re selling into major organizations, when you’re dealing with enterprise accounts the investment that you make is phenomenal. We talked earlier about the physical assets and human assets that you’re using in going after a major account, under any condition the asset are scarce,  you don’t have unlimited resources to help you with the deal. The sooner you can determine whether or not this is a deal you should be pursuing that’s the most important decision you can make. Just as I’ve mentioned earlier an interpersonal communication understanding if you could help someone or you can that’s giving a gift to that person you’re giving a gift to yourself in pursuing enterprise organizations by being able to qualify as quickly as you can whether you should be there or not.

Jim Rembach:    That’s a great point. Gosh, when I started thinking about those words and what you’re explaining is that—how does one get to the point to where they can build either the skills, and I have to say they’re really skills cause it’s a little bit more than just an intuition. How do they build the skills in order to be able to know when to accelerate or get out? Because we always run that risk, of especially in a sales environment, or even in that internal environment where it’s contingent on us making some impact, positive impact of course, and focusing where we can but we also have the fear of pulling out too soon it’s like the whole stock market thing people don’t buy on the high or sell on the high side they wait, “Hey, it’s going to go higher cause I don’t want to lose out on any potential return” and when it drops they don’t sell them either so it’s like they’re stuck with something that they can’t do anything with. How do you know when to go or when to try to grow it?

Brian Sullivan:    Again that’s really significant point. As just often the case, it helps to have a process to follow, Jim. A little example we have Sandler trainer in Austin, Texas and he was meeting with the president of a firm in Austin and the president of the firm told him she said, Every time I make  decision to go after a piece of business it cost me $40,000, win or lose if cost me $40,000.” She said, “If you can help me determine that the deals I go after are the ones I’m most likely to win and also to define in a pursuit I can understand whether I should exit or put my foot on the accelerator I’m really interested. And so what we shared with that client was a   process that we use which evaluates a number of business issues tied to a deal so you can make a determination as to whether your stable or whether you have risk that you need to mitigate. And if you have risk you need to mitigate then you need to take actions to reduce those risks and when you’re finished doing that process with a number different business issues then you’ve got it staring you in the face. If you decide to move forward, when you do have significant risk that’s a calculated decision that you make and you may still make that decision but quite often understanding a level of risk you’re facing will give you the gift of being able to exit the process and then go find an opportunity that you should be applying all the scarce assets to pursue an opportunity that you much more likely to win. So it’s really that having a solid process Jim to help you make those decisions.

Jim Rembach:    Gosh, you know as you were talking, thanks for sharing that, I started even thinking about an internal person whose an expert in their career. Because when I find oftentimes is there’s some people who are stuck in organizations that are highly skilled and nothing can move forward and probably because they don’t have that framework to be able to say, “You know what, it’s time for me to go because I need to be able to give value to some other organization that wants me to do that otherwise I’m going to get frustrated and burned out and then I get burned out in my spot instead going and trying to continue to grow, thanks for sharing that. 

Okay, we chat a little bit about you working with Cap Gemini, with you moving with Sandler and even before that but we know in order for us to grow and get to the point of really solidifying our knowing that we are built to serve takes a bump we have to get over humps and many other humps in life, is there a time where you can remember where you’ve had to get over a hump and it really made a difference for you and your life and career?

Brian Sullivan:    Let me take you in time if I may for just a minute Jim. As you mentioned I started Xerox when I got out of school and interestingly enough you also mentioned that I waited tables and wife is integrated throughout and just want to share that I actually got the job at Xerox from waiting tables. I was waiting tables down at the beach summer between my junior and senior year, waited on a guy from Xerox who asked me to send in my resume. When I got it together I did and that’s ultimately how I ended up getting a job at Xerox. The balls always in play as it were and that was really how I got started in selling. So, at Xerox it was an incredibly collaborative and communicative environment and we were schooled to use all of the assets of the organization to make decisions. And one way that we built that premise is—there was a story, there was a Xerox story that was based on the 914 copier. I don’t know if you know about the 914 copier, but Xerox 914 was the first plain paper copier ever developed and it was built by a bunch of brilliant engineers who took plain paper copying to the point where it could go to market. Before it was a very small company at that point, Xerox took the 914 to market, first machine ever to print on plain paper so it happened that potential to revolutionize an industry. But it sold for $30,000, which was a lot of money in 1959, and it weighed 650 pounds and it took up a footprint of over 20 ft.². So, it was groundbreaking as the technology was and is effective as Xerox selling team was, very few companies, very customers bought the 914. 

So, Xerox undertook an internal cross functional brainstorming exercise and they brought people from throughout the organization, people from manufacturing, finance, accounting and legal in other words they didn’t just say this is a sales problem they marshal all of the elements of the organization together to come up with a new idea, and they did. They came up with the really bold and risky plan that rather than selling 914 they were going to lease them to customers and they were going to lease them at a really economical entry point of $99 per month. And with this economical entry plan they made a huge bet on human nature because they bet that customers were going to get away from copying on to chemically treated paper and dealing with messy inks and that having the opportunity to copy on plain paper would be huge for customers and it was a big, big bet and it worked out really well because for the $99 customers received 2000 copies and for every copy over 2000, Xerox charge an additional cost. After the first six months, after they got a ton of these 914 out in offices the average copies generated by a customer over 20,000 per month. Xerox’s corporate revenues double in one year and a few short years later they were a billion dollar company all based on internal communication and collaboration driving a really great team idea, so that stuck with me, that was something that stuck with me and I carried it with me when I left Xerox. 

Jim Rembach:    That’s a phenomenal story. When you start thinking about all of the people that came together, and also in Xerox I had to imagine this team of engineers that you had to convince as well that could be rather challenging. 

Brian Sullivan:    Oh, no, no question. As you know corporate human nature being what it is the decision typically is, hey, we’ve got a sales problem, let’s change the VP of sales or let’s get a bunch of new sales guys. The Xerox had the thinking, the foresight to be able to say, let’s get everybody together and come up with a really good idea. And who could ever imagined that a pricing shift would produce what actually Forbes magazine would later call the most successful product in the history of the United States regarding ROI all based on really collaborative thinking. And you know, that leads with me today Jim, I remember when I moved on the Cap we had a process where we would make decisions about huge deal that we went after by bringing together an executive committee, bunch of high-level people in the company who all have their political agendas and they would make decisions as to whether to go after a certain piece of business. But I really pioneered bringing the people from the trenches bringing our delivery folks together the folks really had a pragmatic handle on what we’re going to do for the client I marshaled them together to drive the decisions as to whether to go after a piece of business based not on political agendas but based on what was best for the client.

Jim Rembach:    Now there’s no way that was an easy task. Who did you have the most difficulty with when trying to do that? 

Well, that’s a great point. Really folks who had built the executive committee concept and regardless of the fact that virtually—I mean a lot of people were thinking it didn’t work any longer but for the folks who had built it they didn’t want to change. But  after a few success stories, the first few success stories getting involved big wins for us but they involve big deal that we decided not to pursue because we got some really solid input from the delivery team as to what the issues might be in a deal. They often hear people talk about don’t confuse sales and delivery, right? And it’s kind of a really classic failure line because you go sell something and then you ask the delivery team to deliver something that can’t be solved next thing you know you got a deal that’s killing your year. So, by bringing the delivery folks into the decision early on we were able to do deals that were the right deals that would satisfy clients and in the end drive revenue and profitability at the same time.

Jim Rembach:    Yeah, I know. Listening to you talk—for me it’s really one of the reasons why I’ve continued and became certified in emotional intelligence because when you start talking about serving, selling, rapport building, relationship building, its emotional intelligence it’s not the product it’s not your thingy, it’s not what you do, it’s how you engage and interact and how you project it’s all of those things associated with your emotional intelligence that are proven over and over. So, we talked about that you’re trying to grow the enterprise selling business and of course you’ve got a couple of grandkids,  which is awesome, but if you start to look at all the things that you have going on, what are some your goals?

Brian Sullivan:    From a Sandler standpoint my goal is to grow the business so that we can serve clients worldwide. At this point we’re not translated in all the languages we need to and that’s our plan but we’re 127 selling business operations in 12 countries in 18 months of existence which is really exciting but more than anything we’re doing great things in serving clients and arming them with some skills, like the skills I talked about before Jim, the ability to make educated go no go decisions about opportunities that you’re trying to pursue as an organization what we do is we arm our clients with those skills.  So my charter, my challenge, my goal, is to be able to deliver that to Sandler clients all over the world, so that’s from a business standpoint. 

From a personal standpoint, I’m a very, very headed guy and my focus is to serve my family, help our kids grow their families and do anything I can to be there for our kids and grandkids. 

Jim Rembach:    And the Fast Leader Legion wishes you the very best. Now before we move on, let’s get a quick word from our sponsor.

The number one thing that contributes to customer loyalty is emotions. So move onward and upward faster by getting significantly deeper insight and understanding of your customer journey personas with emotional intelligence. With your empathy mapping workshop you learn how to evoke and influence the right customer emotions that generate improve customer loyalty and reduce your cost to operate. Get over your emotional hump now by going to the empathymapping.com to learn more.

Jim Rembach:    Alright Fast Leader listeners it’s time for the Hump Day Hoedown. Okay, Brian, the Hump Day Hoedown is a part of our show where you give us good insights fast. So, I’m going to ask several questions and your job is to give us robust yet rapid responses that are going to help us move onward and upward faster. Brian Sullivan, are you ready to hoedown?

Brian Sullivan:    Yes sir.

Jim Rembach:    Alright. So, what do you think is holding you back from being even better leader today?

Brian Sullivan:    Certainly the challenge to keep pace with technology, social media, data and all the rest. I do a relatively good job of it but truthfully I need to be better.

Jim Rembach:    What is the best leadership advice you have ever received?

Brian Sullivan:    There’s no question about that. We had a CEO at Cap named Jeff and his guidance always was—do what you say you’ll do.

Jim Rembach:    What is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success?

Brian Sullivan:  It’s a service mentality and within that it’s a mindset of responsiveness for the people that you serve. 

Jim Rembach:    What do you feel is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business or life?

Brian Sullivan:    I have two of them, and they’re my ears. 

Jim Rembach:    What would be one book, and it could be from any genre, that you’d recommend to our listeners?

Brian Sullivan:    I’m actually reading it right now and it’s awesome, Black box Thinking by Matthew Syed, the ability to learn from mistakes, we all make them we all better be making them but it’s the old you win or you learn, so it’s how to take a mistake and have it make you more effective in the future.

Okay, Fast Leader listeners you can find links to that and other bonus information from today’s show by going to fastleader.net/Brian Sullivan. Okay, Brian this is my last Hump Day question. Imagine you were given the opportunity to go back to the age of 25 and you’ve been given the opportunity to take the knowledge and skills that you have now back with you but you can’t take everything you could only choose one. So, what skill or piece of knowledge would you take back with you and why?

So I love this, this is the letter to me, right? It would be to be flexible, be willing to stray from the plan take a chance.

Jim Rembach:    Brian it was an honor to spend time with you today, can you please share with the Fast Leader Legion how they can connect with you?

Brian Sullivan:    I’d be delighted to chat with anyone. I could be reached on email at brian.sullivan@sandler.com. Connect with me on LinkedIn, we have a Sandler Enterprise selling group on LinkedIn which we love to have everyone join, so I look forward to hearing from everyone. 

Jim Rembach:    Brian Sullivan, thank you for sharing and wisdom the Fast Leader Legion honors you and thanks you for helping us get over the hump. Woot! Woot! 

Thank you for joining me on the Fast Leader show today. For recaps, links from every show, special offers and access to download and subscribe, if you haven’t already, head on over the fastleader.net so we can help you move onward and upward faster.

END OF AUDIO 

 

 

056: Chip Huth: The common denominator in this stuff was me

Chip Huth Show Notes

Charles “Chip” Huth had just been to a tactical communications class and tried to use this new communications strategy, which he just learned, on his son. When the tactics that worked in class did not work on his son, Chip become very frustrated. That’s when Chip truly realized the hump he needed to get over. Listen to Chip tell his story of how he got over the hump to move onward and upward faster.

Chip, was born in Columbus, Ohio. As a young boy, his family was constantly moving. Until he reached the sixth grade, Chip didn’t even attend the same school two years in a row. All of that instability in moving around could be why he has called call Kansas City, Missouri his home for the past 25-years.

Chip spent his early childhood in a variety of challenging environments. He’s been homeless, lived in missions and Salvation Army facilities, slept in police stations, been in foster care with several families and lived on his own since age 17.

He has a Bachelor’s Degree in Multi-Disciplinary Studies from Grantham University and an Associate’s Degree in Police Science from Park University.

Chip is a Captain with the Kansas City, Missouri Police Department and has 24-years of law enforcement experience.  He currently serves as the Watch I Commander for the Central Patrol Division.

Chip is an adjunct professor for the University of Missouri—Kansas City, a part-time instructor at the Kansas City Missouri Police Leadership Academy, a consultant for the KCPD’s Office of General Counsel, the Missouri Peace Officers Standards and Training Commission, and the Missouri Attorney General’s Office.

Chip is author, speaker, and a certified national trainer in defensive tactics, an expert witness in the field of police operations and reasonable force, and a Subject Matter Expert on police use of force.

Chip is proud to be able to serve people and wants to be remembered as someone who was “others-focused” and helpful. He is particularly interested in helping law enforcement adapt effectively to the changing expectations of their communities.

Chip is currently engaged to the most lovely person he have ever known. He has two grown sons —Christopher and Brandon, and a soon to be step-son Connor.Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Tweetable Quotes and Mentions

Listen to @CharlesHuth1 and get over the hump on the @FastLeaderShow Click to Tweet

“When it comes to leadership there is a commonality there (people).” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet

“Leadership is conferred by the people that are led.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“Anyone can have rank.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“Leadership at every level is what we need.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“We must first accept that the people we’re dealing with have value.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“If everybody’s perspective matters you can get to some very interesting solutions.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“I can’t collaborate with you unless I recognize your inherent worth.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“The more you move up the ranks it’s easy to retreat within yourself.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“I’m not developing any more natural intelligence as I get promoted.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“The key is being able to inspire others to be their best selves.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“See the people around you…as people that count like you count.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“Even a compliment can become condescending when it’s insincere.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“The biggest thing in my life from a leadership perspective…my role as father.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“You don’t truly become a loser until you start blaming people.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“My goal…is to become less occupied with myself.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“Never walk past a small mistake.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“I’m able to assemble teams that make me look a lot better than I am.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

“Humility is the superpower; it’s the thing that I use to accomplish everything.” -Chip Huth Click to Tweet 

Hump to Get Over

Charles “Chip” Huth had just been to a tactical communications class and tried to use this new communications strategy, which he just learned, on his son. When the tactics that worked in class did not work on his son, Chip become very frustrated. That’s when Chip truly realized the hump he needed to get over. Listen to Chip tell his story of how he got over the hump to move onward and upward faster.

Advice for others

The key is being able to inspire others to be their best selves.

Holding him back from being an even better leader

Time management. I spread myself really thin and could use better focus.

Best Leadership Advice Received

Never walk past a small mistake.

Secret to Success

My ability to recognize talent in others.

Best tools that helps in business or Life

Humility. Humility is a superpower.

Recommended Reading

Leadership and Self-Deception: Getting Out of the Box
American Icon: Alan Mulally and the Fight to Save Ford Motor Company

Contacting Chip

Email: Charles.Huth [at] KCPD.org

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charles-huth-85826125

Twitter: https://twitter.com/CharlesHuth1

Resources

54 Emotional Intelligence (EQ) Competencies List: Emotional Intelligence has proven to be the right kind of intelligence to have if you want to move onward and upward faster. Get your free list today.

Show Transcript: 

Click to access edited transcript

056: Chip Huth: The common denominator in this stuff was me

 

Intro: Welcome to the Fast Leader Podcast, where we explore convenient yet effective shortcuts that will help you get ahead and move forward faster by becoming a better leader. And now here’s your host, customer and employee engagement expert and certified emotional intelligence practitioner, Jim Rembach.

“Developing your company’s talent and leadership pipeline can be an overwhelming task but your burn is over with ResultPal you can use the power of practice to develop more leaders faster. Move onward and upward by going to www.resultpal.com/fast and getting a $750 performance package for free.”

 

Jim Rembach:    Okay, Fast Leader Legion, today I have the honor of having somebody on the show who’s really making a significant difference in this world today, and boy, we need what he’s been doing now more than ever. Chip Huth was born in Columbus, Ohio. As a young boy his family was constantly moving until he reached the sixth grade, Chip didn’t even attend the same school two years in a row, all of that instability and moving around could be why he has called Kansas City, Missouri his home for the last 25 years. 

 

Chip spent his early childhood in a variety of challenging environments, he’s been homeless, lived in missions, and Salvation Army facility, slept in police stations and had been in foster care with several families, and lived on his own since his age of 17. Because of being rescued by his uncle he was able to find a stable teenage life on the farm and join the Army. Continuing his growth after the Army, Chip got a Bachelor’s degree in Multidisciplinary Studies from Grantham University and an Associate’s degree in Police Science from Park University.  Chip is a captain with the Kansas City, Missouri Police Department and has 24 years of law enforcement experience. He currently serves as the Watch 1 Commander for the Central Patrol Division. Chip is an adjunct professor for the University of Missouri Kansas City, part-time instructor at the Kansas City Missouri Police Leadership Academy, a consultant for the Kansas City Police Department’s office of General Counsel the Missouri Police Officer Standards and Training Commission and the Missouri Atty. General’s office.

 

Chip is author, speaker and a certified national trainer in defensive tactics and expert witness in the field of police operations and reasonable force and a Subject Matter Expert on police use of force. Chip is proud to be able to serve people wants to be remembered as someone who was others-focused and helpful. He is particularly interested in helping the law-enforcement adapt effectively to the changing expectations of their communities. Chip is currently engaged to the most lovely person he’s ever known. He has two grown sons, Christopher and Brandon and has a soon-to-be stepson Connor. Chip Huth, are you ready to help us get over the hump?

 

Chip Huth:    Jim, thank you very much, it’s a genuine honor to speak with you today. 

 

Jim Rembach:    The honor is mine and I’m glad to able to share you and your story with the Legion. I’ve given them a little bit about but can you tell us what your current passion is so that we can get to know you better?

 

Chip Huth:    Yeah. Leadership, to be honest with you, I’m trying to develop leaders.  When I got promoted to captain, it was a year ago on December 7, the goal was to start developing within our organization future leaders. I see a real need as we’re moving forward, and specially with the challenges that were all seeing today, I see a real need for strong leaders who have good character and a good sense of recognizing the personhood of the people they lead and the people they serve, and so that’s been my biggest lately. It’s a constant opportunity to mentor, opportunity to guide and steer people through and help them navigate some of these tricky situations and [3:31 inaudible] I been writing articles here and there, working on a new edition of a second edition of a book with a co-author all geared toward this very thing. 

 

Jim Rembach:    What you say too—of course it’s in context of law enforcement and police, however, the same thing applies in organizations. Now, one of the main differences, and this is definitely one of those things you have to navigate is that for you and you guys, meaning law enforcement, is that it’s so public, you have the news chasing you around everywhere.  The fact is that there’s a lot of companies and organizations that are out there today that if that lens was cast upon them there’d be more atrocities that are shared on news then unfortunately what happens with law enforcement.

 

Chip Huth:    Yeah. I can absolutely see that and I do have the privilege of working in a lot of corporate space as a consultant and I find great value on that. Some of the work I’ve done in the corporate space has really thought me a lot about leadership in our sector, in the government sector, I’m able to listen to some of these fascinating leaders that are out there in the private sector and adapt some of their strategies and technologies too. When it comes leadership there’s a common ally there, at the end of the day it’s about people. And regardless of, if you’re working in the private sector or public sector, every bit of that involves relationships and people.

 

Jim Rembach:    And I’m so glad you said that. Again one of those other reasons I wanted to have you on the show is to make that point and to say that were in need of people to lead. It means that all ranks, it’s not just—Hey, I have the captain’s bars—it’s also I’m on patrol. 

 

Chip Huth:    Well, at the end of the day, this doesn’t matter in my opinion, always I guess it’s my opinion, but it doesn’t matter whether you’re a CEO on the board room or police captain or a chief or an officer on patrol, leadership conferred by the people that are lead, they have to volunteer to follow you. Anyone can have rank, everyone knows who the boss is, big corner offices and bars on your shoulders and that type of things driving the newest car, at the end of the day, the social environment of your corporation, or of your company, or of your department that determines whether or not you’re effective as leader. Not you and your position, so I couldn’t agree more with that statement, Jim. Leadership at every level is what we need.

 

Jim Rembach:    And you’re right. And the whole of relationship component is a foundational piece. I had the opportunity to work with some law enforcement here not too long ago and we were doing some activities and a comment came back to me and they said, “Wow, I’ve known this person sitting next to me for 25 years and I never knew that about them. I’m not saying that that’s necessarily bad thing but sometimes we just get so caught up in what we have to do, oftentimes, we just don’t take the moments to be able to see who we need to do it with or who we want to do it with, or who if we were collaborating with that we would get more of it done.

 

Chip Huth:    We can say enough about collaboration but in order to get to collaboration we must first accept that the people that were dealing with have value, they add value to what you’re trying to accomplish. If everybody’s perspective matters then you can get to all kinds of very interesting solutions to collaboration. But I can’t collaborate with you unless I recognize your inherent worth as a person. It’s easy, and especially, the more you move the ranks, and it’s easy to retreat within yourself. You start feeling this pressure to have all the answers and have all the best ideas. Unfortunately, I’m not developing anymore natural intelligence as I get promoted, I’m getting more responsibility, I getting more span of control but at the end of the day I’ve got to play with the hand that was held to me. I love the word collaboration, the key is being able to inspire others to be their best selves and to jump in to that makes with you and [8:00 inducible] starts to happen all kinds by this folks around, but you can’t get there without true collegiality and that requires you to see the people around you and the people that you lead as people who coun0t like you count. 

 

Jim Rembach:    The whole value piece is so important. It reminds me of something that I experience yesterday where somebody asked for my assistance because of the things that I’ve come to learn and what I can do as far as helping and assisting others is concerned. However, within 15 minutes the person who asked for my support and help talked about his own people in such a negative way that I almost want to just get up and walk out. I was just like, “I can help you, unless that piece is there, there’s not a whole lot to do. I’m not going to essentially bestow upon you a bigger stick, that’s not what I’m interested in and if you don’t want to quit beating then we don’t have much to talk about.” 

 

Chip Huth:    That distinction you’re talking, that’s a distinction that a lot of people miss. The distinction between the way you are and what you do. The distinction between—in Arbinger language, the company that I work with, we say it’s the difference between your behavior and your way of being. You’ve given this guy a great behavior solution, he’s asking you for behavior solutions but he’s not tending to deeper [9:26 inaudible]. Generally there’s two ways to do almost any behavior, you can do it in someone that you’re dealing with as a person that matters or you can do it in someone your dealing with as an object and the way you are in that behavior changes the whole tone of it, even a compliment can become condescending when it’s insincere and when it lacks authenticity, you hit on something. Well, and again, kudos to you for recognizing that, there’s so many people will just beat that horse trying to get those behavior strategies to folks who really can appreciate or value what’s underneath that.

 

For a long time for me, I was a guy who saw people as either be in my way or being helpful to me or being irrelevant and they fit in to one of those categories. And I didn’t understand that that was hampering me, my ability to lead not only professionally but most certainly as father. I didn’t see how that hamstringing me, and I’m telling you when I realize, when I finally encounter this language it help me understand it in a clear way,  it was life-changing.

 

Jim Rembach:    And I think the really big point is that—we often talk about work life and personal life and professional life, the fact is it’s life and all of that is going to hamstring us or propel us. In know talking about what you’ve gone through in your life and what you’ve been able to achieve,  that resilience, that overcoming your uncle and what he did for you and your family, is that there’s a lot of humps we have to get over and needless to say that they define us and they will cause us to go on a totally different direction, a better direction, sometimes not sometimes we have to go over a couple of humps, but is there a time where you’ve had to get over a hump and you can share that story with us. 

 

Chip Huth:    Yeah. As a [11:25 inaudible]most of their talking, I was thinking about professional things, but really I’d say the biggest thing in my life from a leadership perspective probably the biggest thing for me that always comes mind when you ask that question it has to do with my role as a father. And ultimately there is no more important leadership role, especially in today’s society, I’ve literally witnessed the absence of fathers that contribute to such decline not only in morality but in order, that’s the big common denominator on all of the folks we’ve deal whenever they’re in crisis, is it lacked that kind of leadership. I guess one of the challenges that I had was the way that I used to see things, the lens in which I saw the world, in science they call it paradigm it was seeing people in terms of how they could be useful to me or whether they would get in my way, apparently that way and it’s heartbreaking to share this but it’s also honest. 

 

I remember one day I’m in an airport and I’m waiting on a lay-over and I go in to the bookstore, I like to read I’m looking around I find this book called, Leadership and Self-deception, I like leadership and I’m a philosopher so I thought I understood self-deception at the least, this is kind of interesting, so I picked the book up and I read it and in a couple hours I’m flying to this book. I finished it up on the plane—this is what took away from the book, Jim, and this is embarrassing to say, I got to the last page I thought this book is wonderful, this book tells me what’s wrong with everybody who’s a problem in life. So, I literally started prescribing this book to people that I thought have problems, “You need to read this book, this will fix you up.” That was my mindset, this happens.  

 

And I pick my son Christopher from school a couple of days later and I’ve just been to a tactical communications class in in-service training. And so I’m driving to get Chris, I get him in the car he’s clearly got a problem. He has hardly sleep and really sad, he’s down and what I’m going to do as a dad, concern father, I’m going to practice this communication strategy on my son, that I just learned. So I start asking him, “Hey, son what’s going on? What’s the problem?” and he’s not giving me anything. We’re driving home and I’m certainly were frustrated cause this techniques work in class, and it’s not working. We get to the driveway, I pull in, and I put the car in park and I will never ever forget this, it’s emotional every time I talk about it. I say to Chris, “Chris why won’t you tell me what’s wrong?” And Chris said, “Dad you wouldn’t understand.” And so I turned sideways on the seat towards him and I said, “Chris what makes you think I wouldn’t understand?” You see what I’m doing there, opening a question just like I was taught, and he turn on his seat and when he does his eyes are full of tears and he looks right through me an says, “Because you’re a robot, dad.” And he gets out of car and he goes in the house and I remember sitting in the driveway and what I realize in that moment, I thought back to the book that I read, Leadership and self-deception, and I realize this Chris was not responding to what I was doing, he was responding to who I was as a person. Who I was person as a person, as a dad who he knew me to be. At the level behavior I was doing everything right, if you are a behavior coach, you’re like, you’re asking open and end questions, you’ve turned your body toward him, you’re sincere—you’re appearing to be sincere, you’re doing all the things that they would tell would be perfect in a communications setting, but he’s not responding to that he’s respond to who I am and what I’m doing, that was part of the moment I suddenly realized that that books was talking to me. 

 

Jim Rembach:    That kind of make me think about some of the times where my kids would say that back to me. So when you start thinking about where you went from there, how did you change that around for you and Chris?

 

Chip Huth:    I’ll tell you what I did, Jim. I dived into this concept of self-deception deeply. I went so far as to be become involved with the Arbinger Institute. I’m currently a senior consultant for them these people are my friends now, the founders of the company—we converse, we collaborate, I’m involved in this company deeply, I don’t mean it lightly, I feel like they saved my life I had practically destroyed two marriages single-handedly. I was married to a young woman when we were kids, the mother of my children, I was 19, 20 years old when we got married. I remember driving down the road one day and thinking, “Man, I really got a lemon here, this isn’t working out, I can’t believe this happens to such a nice guy, that I’ve got this loser for a life.” And I start to process in deconstructing this relationship all around me and we end up getting a divorce. Then I set out and seek, again being obviously romantic, I’ve not given up on love, so I go looking for another wife. I find a wife another wonderful woman totally opposite in every way from my first wife. We get married and wife goes good for a little while and the next thing you know, we’re going down the same path and we end up in divorce. And sitting around thinking about this and this comes to the common denominator in this stuff in both this marriages was me. This women were completely different in every possible way and I was the common denominator, I didn’t see it, I was blind to it. And so by understanding this concept a little bit better about self-deception, it enabled me to see so many things differently. See my role not only professionally as a leader but as a father as a partner to see it totally differently. And it was hard lesson, I think the biggest thing that that I want folks to understand is, we all—this doesn’t comes naturally to anybody—we all struggle. You’re in and out of this box and you’re trying constantly, hopefully trying constantly to improve. It’s when we become complacent and start blaming everyone around us. You don’t truly become a loser when you start blaming people, I believe that I truly do and there’s where I was at. 

 

Jim Rembach:    Thanks for sharing how you’ve had the opportunity to change that situation and what it meant for you. I would say that again, there’s so many people that have experienced that and never come to the realization that the common denominator is them. And that’s one reason why we do the Fast Leader show, is because hopefully we’ll correct that and it’ll be the situation where we can get over the hump, so thanks for sharing. I know you have a lot of things going on. You were talking about your career as a captain, congratulation again for the promotion, and author, consultant, go on and on, I know you have another book coming out, when you look out all the things on your plate what are some of your goals?

 

Chip Huth:    My biggest goal sounds probably a little bit vague but my biggest goal is to find ways to be helpful to others. I really want to, as you said when you introduced me—thank you for that wonderful introduction—I want to be remembered and I want to be someone who’s focused on other people. A friend of mine, he’s a Navy Seal captain, and we talked about this idea and he brings a very clear point of saying, “Look, in Navy Seal training and Basic Underwater Demolition/SEAL BUD/S school, which is known around the world as one of the toughest, hardest military trainings in the world, they can always tell when or who at that first of these classes are going to quit.  They come from all different walks of life, they’re professional athletes, the farm boys like me and when they’re all lined up out there they’re not able to tell rule out the bad who’s going to quit. But what he said to me was very [20:00 inaudible] he said, “You can’t tell who’s going to quit, but you can generally tell when they’re going to quit,” and he said, “That’s the point when they stop focusing on the mission and their teammates and start focusing on themselves. When they start thinking about how cold, wet, tired and hungry they are it’s inevitable, it’s not a matter if they’re going to ring out that’s win.” And I’m telling you what, that is it, that is so telling. And so my goal and what I’m trying to do now is to become less occupied with myself and I find it so much rewarding trying to help others grow and trying to share credit and trying to share, as you said collaborate with people to accomplish things, that’s the biggest thing I’m working on.

 

If you’re going to talk about project wise, the second edition of Jack and I’s book is a big thing right now, we’ve dived deep into, Arbinger’s helping us work with that, we’ve acquired the rights from the publisher for the second edition. The goal doing behind that was, first of all, my publisher’s awesome but we can’t control the price point and our goal behind doing the second edition is we’ll be able to be able to control the price point and be able to hand the book to people and have it be more helpful. It was never about making a buck, it was sharing this philosophy and cascading it out. My heart breaks weekly when I see the news and I see how law enforcement is struggling to communicate. Our intentions to folks, and I want to be able to get that book out as kind of a platform to start a discussion with law enforcement. So many people have not been able to read it because [21:38 inaudible] it as a textbook. The average cop have to spend $50 for a book, they got families to feed, so I’m really excited about that project. So there’s a little bit of—what I’m working on personally and then what I’m working on externally if that was helpful.

 

Jim Rembach:    It was perfect her and the fast leader legion wishes you the very best. Now before we move on let’s get a quick work from our sponsor. 

 

 A dry leadership pipeline shouldn’t clog your business from moving onward and upward get over the hump by filling the gap between leadership development and top performance with Result Pal. Rocket to success resultpal.com/fast and getting a $750 performance package for free. 

 

Alright here we go Fast Leader listeners it’s time for the Hump Day Hoedown. Okay Chip the Hump Day Hoedown is the part of our show where you give us good insights fast. So, I’m going to ask you several questions and your job is to give us robust yet rapid responses that are going to help us move onward and upward faster. Chip Huth are you ready to hoedown?

 

Chip Huth:    Let’s get it on. 

 

Jim Rembach:    What do you think is holding you back from being an even better leader today?

 

Chip Huth:    Without a doubt I’d say my biggest struggle’s time management. I spread myself really thin and I take on a lot and I really, really could use a little more focus. 

 

Jim Rembach:    What is the biggest leadership advice you have received? 

 

Chip Huth:    Oh! My God, never walk past the small mistake. 

 

Jim Rembach:    What is one of your secrets that you believe contributes to your success?

 

Chip Huth:    Without a doubt it’s my ability to recognize talent in others.  I can recognize someone, when they walk in a room I can see their potential because I was able to assemble teams that frankly make me look a lot better than I am. 

 

Jim Rembach:    What do you feel is one of your best tools that helps you lead in business and life?

 

Chip Huth:    Humility. Without a doubt humility is the super power. It’s the thing that I leverage to accomplish everything.

 

Jim Rembach:    What would be one book that you’d recommend to our listeners, it could be from any genre?

 

Chip Huth:    Oh! My Lord, so many books…okay, on top of the head, American Icon by Bryce Hoffman. It’s a story of the Ford Motor Company’s turnaround under Allen Mullaly. 

 

Jim Rembach:    Okay Fast Leader listeners, you can find links to that and other bonus information from today show by going to fastleader.net/Chip Huth. Alright Chip, this is my last Hump Day Hoedown question: Imagine you were given the opportunity to go back to the age of 25 and you’ve been given the opportunity to take the knowledge and skills that you have now back with you, but you can’t take everything you can only take one thing, what skill or knowledge would you take back with you and why?

 

Chip Huth:    Jim, that’s a great question. I would probably have to say, the skill that’s benefited me the most is the skill of listening with the intent to understand instead of the intent to respond, that’s probably the skill I’d take back. 

 

Jim Rembach:    Chip it was honor to spend time with you today, can you please share with the Fast Leader listeners how they can connect with you?

 

Chip Huth:    Yeah. Anyone can email me anytime, it really is where to get hold of me, my primary email is charles.huth@kcpd.org and that’s the best way you can get hold of me. I return every single email even if it takes a week or two. And anyone that emails me I’m always available to be helpful, that’s probably the best way. I’m here in Kansas City, Missouri with the PD as the Watch One commander for the entire downtown area. If you’re here in Kansas City and fly down here please also say you know Chip, they’re probably going to know you’re tough, that’s another good way to get all. 

 

Jim Rembach:    Chip Huth take you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom the Fast Leader Legion honors you and take you for helping us get over the hump. Woot! Woot!

 

Thank you for joining me on the Fast Leader Show today. For recaps, links from every show, special offers and access to download and subscribe, if you haven’t already, head on over the www.fastleader.net so we can help you move onward and upward faster. 

 

END OF AUDIO